On this podcast, we talk about why Carve Designs initially went wholesale before going D2C, the resurgence of traditional marketing strategies, why you should invest in IP rights before starting a brand, and so much more!
As a company born at the beach and endlessly inspired by the outdoors, taking care of the planet is close to our heart.
85% of our styles are made of sustainable materials and 100% of our swim is made from recycled plastic bottles.
Each swimsuit keeps 5 plastic bottles out of a landfill and we've pioneered the use of sustainable materials through the creation of our Coconut Balsa™and FlyWeight™ fabrics.
It all began on a surf trip to San Pancho, Mexico for two friends, Jennifer Hinton and Thayer Sylvester.
As we lounged in a hammock waiting for the waves to roll back in, we lamented how hard it was to find boardshorts that could keep up with us – real women with real bodies and a real passion for adventure.
And just like that, Carve Designs was born. Carve Designs styles represent our spirit: fun-loving, hardworking, confident, and inclined to get where we want to go.
Carve Designs began as a surf apparel company selling rash guards and board shorts in 2003, and has grown into a complete beach lifestyle brand, offering surf, swim, and lifestyle clothing.
We are dedicated to providing effortless feminine clothing that actually fit real women while keeping us connected to the calm content feeling that inspires us at the beach.
The women of Carve Designs are determined to push the boundaries of everyday apparel and prove that functionality can be fashionable and well-fitting.
The clothes are designed to be as inspirational and versatile as the women who wear them.
We continue to stay true to the vision we created over 18 years ago, providing stylish apparel targeted to women actively engaged in the outdoor world.
In This Conversation We Discuss:
Resources:
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Chase Clymer
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Thayer Sylvester
You can't enter the marketplace without a differentiated product and value proposition. You have to be bringing something to the market niche.
Chase Clymer
Welcome to Honest Ecommerce, a podcast dedicated to cutting through the BS and finding actionable advice for online store owners. I'm your host, Chase Clymer. And I believe running a direct-to-consumer brand does not have to be complicated or a guessing game.
On this podcast, we interview founders and experts who are putting in the work and creating real results.
I also share my own insights from running our top Shopify consultancy, Electric Eye. We cut the fluff in favor of facts to help you grow your Ecommerce business.
Let's get on with the show.
Hey everybody, welcome back to another episode of Honest Ecommerce. I'm your host, Chase Clymer.
And today --I love it when I get to interview two founders at once-- I'm welcoming to the show, Thayer and Jennifer coming to me from Carve Designs. Welcome to the show.
Thayer Sylvester
Hi, thanks for having us.
Jennifer Hinton
Hi!
Chase Clymer
Absolutely. So for those that don't know, can you just give me a quick crash course on the products that you bring into the market over at Carve Designs?
Thayer Sylvester
Yeah, absolutely. Carve Designs is an aspirational lifestyle brand. And we try to make women feel good when they get dressed every day, whether they're just going to go on a surf trip or just going to the soccer field to watch their kid play or shopping around.
Our motto really is "You feel like you're getting dressed every day." And we've been out for a little while trying to make that happen.
Chase Clymer
You absolutely have been at it a little while. So take me back to 2003. Where did the idea to start this brand come from?
Jennifer Hinton
Well, we were quite literally sitting on a hammock in Sayulita, Mexico on our very first surf trip with nothing to wear, no shit.
Thayer and Jennifer
(laughs)
Jennifer Hinton
And so that is when the idea was formulated. We were a little bit frustrated planning for the trip. Got on the trip and we were both...
I think [we] brought men's board shorts with us and bikinis that were not cute, and just felt a little bit strange out there trying to battle the waves. And so that is literally how it all came to fruition.
Chase Clymer
Absolutely. So you guys, you have this idea. You see a hole in the market. How long does it take from that beach conversation to get a sample product in your hand?
Thayer Sylvester
The sample product took a few years. So we came back from the surf trip and then started to try and make sure that our vision was based a little bit in reality, and sort of planning the business...
And we were both in our late 20s, and otherwise employed, and started a little while to take the plunge, if you will. But once we did so, that was about a year to have prototypes.
So we had conceived the idea in late 2001 and then finally launched the business in 2003. But we had no experience in apparel whatsoever. We knew nothing. And we didn't know what we were doing.
We went to the Academy of Arts here in San Francisco to buy books on powder making, CAD, apparel CAD design, what any sort of production looks like, and so we weren't going to be able to raise any money but we knew we had a good idea.
And we traveled down to San Diego, and put a tradeshow booth in the back of our car and tried to sell some products.
Chase Clymer
Absolutely. And so was that the launch was just going to trade shows or... How did it evolve from there?
Thayer Sylvester
Yeah. So the first launch was for our product and we went to the ASR Trade Show in San Diego where we were launching wholesale specialty retailers. And our first product was in store in Spring of 2004.
Chase Clymer
Nice. So it was that the game plan at the beginning was kind of the wholesale model.
Thayer Sylvester
Yeah, absolutely. We wanted to make sure that we could find our customer and we thought that having people feel the product in person is an integral part of their purchasing experience.
And so we want to start there. Well, in the shop internet shopping wasn't really popular (laughs) in the ancient times.
Chase Clymer
Well, that was a question that I had for you coming up. It was, when did getting carve designs online and start selling direct-to-consumer become such a major piece?
I know it's a bigger piece today because we have some history, but for those that don't know, obviously, it came along, the online element and changed the game for you.
Thayer Sylvester
Yeah. So for us, online shopping, just like a lot of other experiences, has always been part of the experience since like 2007. I think we launched our first website and then we consistently have a customer following that, who finds it convenient.
And we've continued to raise our brand awareness through social media and online selling really with a huge emphasis since 2016. And funny enough, our very first website, you couldn't shop online. It was just like a...
Jennifer Hinton
"Go here."
Thayer Sylvester
"Learn about the brand."
Jennifer Hinton
Yeah. Learn about the brand, but you couldn't buy a thing. And it was actually not very functional at all. But it was beautiful. We were like, "It has to be beautiful."
Chase Clymer
Do you remember when you finally dove all in on Ecommerce and started getting your first sales online? Was there anything surprising about it?
Thayer Sylvester
Well, what we always loved about it was that our customer liked the same product, whether she was shopping in store or online.
And so we knew that we were continuing to serve our customer that felt like she was buying something she couldn't find somewhere else.
Chase Clymer
Now we can kind of take it to the present again. You guys have such an amazing history, have the goals of Carve changed? Where do you see the company heading in the future?
Jennifer Hinton
Total world domination. Just kidding. (laughs) We've talked extensively about going in so many different avenues, possibly opening up stores...
But we have a lot of low hanging fruit right now. Especially with growing Ecommerce. And so we're really excited about that. But I definitely think that we want to be a lifestyle brand that people know and can rely on.
I guess the only word that I can come up with is [being] household name. But I think you know, some big brand presence is a huge goal of ours.
Chase Clymer
Absolutely. Now, with trying to become a household brand, I know you guys create amazing products. How are you marketing those these days?
Obviously, there's been some crazy stuff that's happened with iOS 15 and all sorts of attribution is crazy. What is working for you? And what are you trying to tell?
What would you tell a young entrepreneur that was trying to get into the marketing of products in your space, the women's space?
Thayer Sylvester
Well...
Jennifer Hinton
(laughs)
Thayer Sylvester
It's become additionally more complex over the last couple of years. I do think that it got... It became a little bit easy.
Facebook made finding new customers, at least in our demographic, easier than you had been prior to that.
So we sort of thought about digital marketing for the last little bit as sort of the "Wild West." You could just kind of throw stuff out there and it would work.
And you could spend a lot of money across different channels, and a lot of them were very efficient. But you've had to become a lot smarter right now.
So I think that you can't enter the marketplace without a differentiated product and value proposition. You have to be bringing something to the market niche that she or whoever your customer base can't find anywhere else.
And then you have to be very strategic about how you're spending your limited resources. Money doesn't grow on trees and these are businesses that have to figure out how to make money, not just spend it.
And then you need a good team of people who understand who your customer is, what you're selling, and how you appeal to her. And that has become more complicated.
We market across every digital channel and direct mail. We're not getting into television right now.
But I think there are lots of emerging brands because the efficacy of digital advertising has decreased in growing brand new awareness that you're looking back at channels that work.
I have seen competitive brands recently spend a lot of money sponsoring athletic events and getting back into more traditional media.
So really, it's a question of just continuing to go back to fundamentals: How are you going to find your customer? And do you have a product that she or they want that differentiates yourself and makes it more compelling from a competitive marketplace?
Chase Clymer
Absolutely. It's been a lot of fun over the last couple of years to see more traditional media, all these direct-to-consumer brands go into it.
Yeah, I remember seeing the first time I saw a billboard for what I know was like a direct-to-consumer, digitally native brand.
Thayer Sylvester
Yeah.
Chase Clymer
I was just like, "Oh, it's like that must be actually a better CPM or cost to do that route these days."
Thayer Sylvester
Well, that's where it becomes very complicated, right? You can't track it the same way that you can click on search or shopping.
And so you really have to take a holistic view at all of your marketing spend, and you know, we launched this beautiful marketing campaign, this spring Women X Good.
And Jen has her first documentary film that's out. She was talking to people about our influence as a brand and who we stand for. And you can't you can't measure that necessarily on a cost per click, but you can think about it as creating a brand.
Chase Clymer
Absolutely. I think that's something a lot of young entrepreneurs don't really figure out really. Somebody has to specifically tell them. There's a huge difference between marketing and advertising.
Advertising is kind of going for that response, going for that sales and marketing is strictly for brand awareness, and getting your name into people's heads and kind of getting trying to walk them down that know like and trust kind of small funnel that a lot of people like to talk about out there.
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Thayer Sylvester
This small funnel is easy to track. And then it holds people accountable. And you can view it over a very short span and nobody has attention spans.
You have to be doing long range planning and think about your diversity of status so that you can invest in growing the brands while also paying attention to metrics like conversion rates.
Chase Clymer
You've been doing this for quite some time, almost two decades.
Thayer Sylvester
Oh don't remind us. (laughs) Thank you so much.
Chase Clymer
(laughs) No, it's amazing. What's the statistic? Most 90% of brands fail in the first year? You guys have been doing it for so long.
But this question though is through that time, do any mistakes come to mind that you want to mention for the listeners like, "Hey, we did this. We made this mistake. Don't do this."
Jennifer Hinton
I feel like, first of all, making a mistake is the only way that you can figure out where you went wrong and why. And so it's always a learning... It's always a place of learning.
So you can't say, "Oh, this was a mistake. Avoid this." Because I think that one mistake for Carve might not be a mistake for Rumpl. Do you know what I mean? So it's like…
Chase Clymer
Yeah.
Jennifer Hinton
it's all different. But yeah, so (laughs) there's been so many mistakes on so many different levels.
Thayer Sylvester
As far as "don't do", the only thing you have to make sure you do is invest in your intellectual property rights before you invest in the business.
Jennifer Hinton
Yeah. Absolutely
Thayer Sylvester
That's a non-starter. And if you can't afford to do that, you shouldn't be starting a business, because you will potentially risk all of your investment in the business for the business not being able to move forward. So intellectual property is a non-starter for people.
And then you have to have a team. Jen and I were lucky in that we were our team and our skill sets are very complementary. And our... [We] haven't been able to evolve over time. You have to be able to understand your strength, your weakness...
"What am I not good at? How am I going to hire to help that or find an advisor to push me forward?" but you have to be very aware of what you're good at and what you're not good at?
Because there are going to be obstacles thrown at you. And you better be able to figure out how to solve those problems.
Jennifer Hinton
Yeah, the ego has to be put to the side.
Thayer Sylvester
Yeah.
Jennifer Hinton
For sure. And if you can't do that, then yeah, you'll definitely... You'll just go down.
Chase Clymer
Yeah, I couldn't agree more. Learning your strengths and weaknesses and then hiring for your weaknesses is like the ultimate key to finding growth and allowing you to focus on the things that you're uniquely or independently the best at.
Thayer Sylvester
That's right. Yeah.
Chase Clymer
Now, is there anything that I didn't ask you about today that you think might resonate with our audience?
Thayer Sylvester
Well, I think you didn't ask us if we've had fun.
Chase Clymer
(laughs) Have you had fun building a business over the...
Thayer Sylvester
Yeah! It's a lot of fun. I mean, it's really stressful. But it's... If you had to ask both of us, "Iis there anything else we would have rather been doing?" And the answer's no. And at the end of the day, that makes you feel good going to bed at night.
Even if you're worried about whatever problem you're having that day in order to continue to push the business forward, you feel fulfilled in a way that you may not have if you didn't take that risk.
Chase Clymer
Entrepreneurship is the coolest thing in the world. You can wake up and solve problems for people or invent solutions to problems. It's so much fun. I think that it also is something that is...
You can learn to be a better entrepreneur. But if you don't really have that drive, you have to be a little bit more open to risk at times.
Thayer Sylvester
You absolutely have to be able to take risks. Yes.
Yes, you have to be willing to let everything drop away tomorrow and start again.
Chase Clymer
Yeah, but you can always find another way to make a dollar.
Thayer Sylvester
Yeah, because at the end of the day, it's not about that. It's about how you feel.
Chase Clymer
Yeah. As long as you're happy.
Thayer Sylvester
And you need the money in order to feel secure at night and raise your family. And there are lots of different ways to make money.
Some people climb the corporate ladder or they're like you and they continue to make choices where they're doing something that they love and that's where we are.
We chose to literally quit our corporate jobs to start something that we believed in. And now we're really excited.
And we love that most of the people that work for us are women and they're moms, and we provide them a supportive environment where they can continue to thrive.
As for linen, we're focused on making sure that our product has the least impact on the environment that it can while we're in our manufacturing process, and we recognize that it's sometimes hard to feel good, and we're giving you a little piece of goodness in your life every day.
Chase Clymer
Absolutely. Yeah. Thanks for that. I forget to ask. It's all about the journey, right? It's not the destination.
Thayer Sylvester
That's right. Yeah.
Chase Clymer
Now we are coming up on the end of the podcast here, for those that are curious about the products that I've been talking so much about, where should they go to check them out?
Jennifer Hinton
carvedesigns.com And then in so many other places. But carvedesigns.com has the entire line. But then we have some great partners like Title Nine, REI, Backcountry.
I don't want to piss people off because there's so many.
Thayer Sylvester
We're going in a car.
Jennifer Hinton
We're going in a car.
Thayer Sylvester
And check out the new Oahu short which is this retro classic cut-off quarter short that is in, I think at least 20 colors right now. Everyone has to have their specific piece.
And then our swimwear, 2-piece swimwear. It's fabulous. And women of all ages from my teenage daughters to Jen's mom can find something that they like because the prints are vibrant and fresh and the fit is totally solid.
Chase Clymer
Absolutely. I couldn't thank you guys so much for coming on the show today. And I hope to have you back soon.
Thayer and Jennifer
Thank you. Nice to see you.
Chase Clymer
Alright. I can't thank our guests enough for coming on the show and sharing their knowledge and journey with us.
We've got a lot to think about and potentially add into our own business. You can find all the links in the show notes.
Make sure you head over to honestecommerce.co to check out all the other amazing content that we have.
Make sure you subscribe, leave a review. And obviously if you're thinking about growing your business, check out our agency at electriceye.io. Until next time.